Authors: Joan; Barthel
K: | Well, could you have been that mad at her to want to do something like that? |
P: | No. |
K: | Seeing that's where you came from. |
P: | Yes, I bet I could. |
K: | Assuming this happened, what would you have done? How would you have done it? |
P: | I don't know. I wouldn't know how. If I was that mad I would have tried anything, right?⦠Mutilate or damage her. |
K: | Right, right ⦠your mother was cut up a little bit, you know? |
P: | Was it a straight razor that was used? |
K: | I don't know that. |
P: | I'm pretty sure it was a straight razor. Now, it seems to me it's a straight razor. It may have been a knife. I don't know. I'm not too clear on that, so the straight razor seems clear to me. |
By now, the knives the police had found in Barbara's house were being catalogued and tagged, destined for the police crime lab at Bethany. The razor was going there too. The straight razor Peter was talking about. The razor that hadn't been found behind the barn, or behind the gas station, but on the third shelf in the living room, the usual place.
K: | OK. The one part whenâwhat you said to meâcut out her sexual organs. What made you think of something like that? |
P: | That's all I could think of left. |
K: | Why? |
P: | I don't know why but that's what came out. So, if you want to use that as something I said, you know ⦠|
K: | Oh no, no, no. I'm just wonderingâI'm just curious whyâwhy did you say something like that? This could be important. |
P: | I don't know. It was just something that all of a sudden came out of nowhere, in my head. |
K: | Did one of those other fellows mention that? |
P: | Nope. Just something that was there. It could be possibly something from what actually happened. |
K: | As I say, they don't know for sure yet, you know? |
P: | Yes. |
K: | But, I mean, that was an interesting statement. |
A: | Was that up to what you expected? There wasn't anything wrong with the statement? |
K: | Oh, no, no, no. It was just sort of interesting the way you said that, that's all. |
P: | Said what? |
K: | About raping her. |
P: | I didn't say it in the statement. |
K: | I know you didn't say it in the statement. I said about the way you said it to me. |
P: | Do you have a coat or something? |
K: | Why, are you cold? |
P: | Yes. |
K: | I can shut this window. You don't have a coat? |
P: | No. |
K: | Shut the window down for you, how's that? |
P: | I'm warm-blooded. I can't stand it if it's ninety degrees or more. |
K: | Why don't I get a hold of these fellows and we'llâwhat's this, your wallet? |
P: | Yes. |
K: | You haven't got much in it, huh? |
P: | No money. |
K: | Who's this, your girl friend? |
P: | Oh, it's just a girl I really liked once and since I had the picture I didn't want to get rid of it. |
K: | Whose Ford is that? |
P: | I cut that out of a magazine. It's a thirty-nine. |
K: | I was gonna say it was a thirty-nine. I had a thirty-seven. |
P: | Did you? I had a thirty-six. |
K: | I had a four-door station. |
P: | Did you? I had one of the first vee-eights. There should be a girl's phone number in there too. |
K: | Well, I don't want to see it. I don't want to pry. I'm going to see if I can get hold of these fellows. As I say, I'm looking at you here and you really look like you're exhausted. |
P: | What fellows? |
K: | Fellows who brought you here. So, relax for a minute. |
P: | You don't think I can lie there on the couch ⦠|
K: | Well, Jesus, if you do we'll never get you up, Pete. |
Mulhern came back.
M: | Hey, Pete, I got one thing I want you to clear. You told me you remembered slashing at your mother's throat. |
P: | Mm-hm. |
M: | Did you cut her throat when you slashed at her? |
P: | Yes. |
M: | You did cut her. How far did you cut her? |
P: | I don'tâlet's seeâit wasn't that largeâthat much. Something like that. |
M: | OK. Well, I have to take a short statement from you that you did cut her. OK? Let me have your pen back again. |
P: | Thank God for high school students. |
M: | You're not kidding. When I changed out of my uniform to this suit again I must have grabbed my pen and I took it out with my pencil and threw it up by my wallet and forgot to take the damned thing. |
P: | Where's your uniform? |
M: | At home. I went home andâI've been up since you were up last night. |
P: | I've been up since seven to seven-thirty Friday morning, except for that sleep I got this morning. |
M: | How come you spell your name R-E-I-L-L-Y? Why do you do that? Why not R-I-E? |
P: | 'Cause that's the way I always spell it. |
M: | When you slashed at her, how did you do it? |
P: | Like that. |
M: | You went from left to right? |
P: | Yeah. |
M: | Just like that? |
P: | Only I used my right hand and I came across backwards. |
M: | So you used your right hand, you came from the right side. |
P: | Well, I came like that. From the left side to the right. |
M: | From your left shoulder to your right shoulder? |
P: | Uh-huh. |
M: | Did you draw blood? |
P: | That I don't remember. I don't remember anything about blood, until I get to where I'm back at a normal state again. This is when I called the ambulance. |
M: | You saw the razor cut, though? |
P: | I'm pretty sure. It's almost like in a dream. You know what I mean? |
M: | OK, sign. |
P: | Here? |
M: | Mm-hm. |
P: | And, here? Corner? |
M: | No, not there. |
P: | Are you proud of me? |
M: | Yeah. You want a jacket? Here, try this on, and I'll be right back. Peter, here's what I'm gonna do. I'm going to tape these two together, all right? Do me a favor on this one here. I put in August. I want you to cross it out where we're into September and have you initial it so we got the right one. I'm gonna take these two pages and combine them into one. By August twenty-eighth, that should be September. |
P: | Yes. |
M: | I want you to draw a line through all of it. |
P: | Why? So they'll know I corrected it when I read it? |
M: | Yes. It shows that ⦠that I didn't change it later. That when it was shown to you, you changed it to September, the correct month. All right, now put your initials. As I say, what I'm gonna do is take these two and combine them into one, all one page. |
P: | OK. Can I have another one of your cigarettes? |
M: | I left them there so you can smoke them. |
P: | I shouldn't smoke other people's cigarettes, it bothers me. |
M: | Why? |
P: | I feel guilty about it. You must have given a pack and a half already. Any particular degree of murder? Like murder one? |
M: | No, there's no premeditation. What's the show you watch that you got that out of? |
P: | No, |
M: | Well, like I told you coming up here, all you have to do is tell the truth. Then you feel better ⦠|
P: | When I get it straightened out will you get me the help that I need? |
M: | ⦠and everybody comes out a little better off. |
P: | Do you feel bad about knowing me, now that you know what I've done? |
M: | No, why should I feel bad? Hey, you know these thingsâeverybody blows up once in awhile. |
P: | But this is pretty serious, isn't it? |
M: | So, that makes you a lesser man, you lost your temper at one particular time? Huh? |
P: | Well ⦠|
M: | Do you think it's really that terrible? |
P: | Yes. |
M: | Well, it sounds terrible, murder and all that, and your mother's being involved, and yourself killing her, yes. But, I'm not a guy to sit here and judge you on something that you did. I mayâfive years from nowâI may do the same thing. Nobody knows what goes on inside your mind, what goes on inside my mind. |
P: | I'm not being punished for what I did, I'm being helped. Right? |
M: | Yeah. |
P: | It's not a case where I need punishment. Correct? Whereas going to jail will punish me. Getting the help is something that I need. |
M: | Just don't interrupt me. |
P: | I'm sorry. |
M: | I keep losing my place. OK, Pete, read that one over. Do that. This and this go together like this. |
P: | I gotta what? Read them all? |
M: | No, just the two that I combined into the one there. |
P: | I'd like to certify oneâ |
M: | Clarify. |
P: | âclarify one point which I changed. Where do I sign? |
M: | Right here. And right there. Now, getting back to what we were saying before, you will be charged with murder. All right? |
P: | Will I need a lawyer? |
M: | I can't advise you one way or the other. You have a right to have a lawyer. |
P: | Yeah, but, I meanâthe statement. |
M: | Doesn't matter. You can have an attorney at any time you want. |
P: | Yeah, but I mean, everything I said I mean, I mean it is the truth. |
M: | If you want to have an attorney, you have the right to have an attorney. If you can't afford one the court will appoint an attorney for you. But, this is a determination that you have to make. |
P: | Um, could I have any particular person advise me besides an attorney if I want to choose one? |
M: | Who do you have in mind? |
P: | Well, I meant Lieutenant Craig. |
M: | Lieutenant Shay? He cannot do it. |
P: | He can't advise me? |
M: | Pete, he's working on the investigation. The same way I couldn't adviseâ |
P: | What am I gonna do? Am I gonna end up answering all my questions myself? |
M: | Well, this is what I say. If you want to have an attorney, hire an attorney. I can't go out and hire you an attorney. At the same time I can't act as a legal adviser for you. |
P: | Do I have to have a licensed attorney? |
M: | He has to be licensed in the state of Connecticut. |
P: | What's going to happen to my things back in the house? I have a whole house full of stuff and the rent to pay and stuff like that. |
M: | Right now that house is in our possession. Nothing can be done to that house at this particular time. |
P: | Well, will they keep pets in there? There's a parrakeet in a cage and there's also a cat there. |
M: | Well, how about Geoffrey or Arthur? Won't they feed the cat or take care of the place? |
P: | Yeah, I guess. Also, if I'm going to be in a hospital, can I take my guitar with me? |
M: | Now, that I honestly don't know. I don't see why they would object, and again maybe they will. |
P: | What about the motor vehicleâthe car? Will it be impounded by the state police, orâ |
M: | No, see, we can't impound anything unless it has something to do with the crime. |
P: | I locked it up and left it in the yard there. Could the state police keep an eye on it and make sure no one tampers with it? |
M: | You don't have any family at all do you, Peter? |
P: | I just got my godmother who right now is in Canada. She doesn't know anything about this. Well, I don't care, if someone wants the pets they can have them. No, I don't want them to die. I want someone to take care of them. If someone will take them. |
M: | Well, I don't think there's any problem. If worse comes to worse we can leave the pets to the SPCA. |
P: | Yes. I don't think worse is gonna come to worse though. |
M: | I know you would be disappointed if you came home and they were dead. |
P: | Oh, I figured out where I got that murder one and murder two bit. |
M: | Where? |
P: | From Do they have that anywhere? Or is that just something they made up for television? |
M: | Oh, I think New York State used to have different degrees of murder. |
P: | What I did is gonna beânotâI mean it's gonna be murder but it's notâit's not like premeditated because I didn't plan. You know what I mean? |
M: | I really don't know. We'll turn it over to the State's Attorney. You will be charged with murder. Now, it's up to him if he wants to drop it down to something lower. |
P: | What would he drop it down to? |
M: | There's murder and there's manslaughter. And, there's homicide with a motor vehicle.⦠They're a form of murder but they're not murder. |
P: | What is manslaughter? |
M: | I still get a little bit confused now. I worked under the old general statute which was different. It takes awhile, Pete ⦠Aren't you going to eat your sandwich? |
P: | I've just been nibbling at it, you know? Every time I eat something, you know, it fills me a little bit but then I lose my appetite just like that. |
M: | Well, let me go give this to the lieutenant and I'll be back. |